From aheinecke at gnupg.org Wed Feb 8 19:56:19 2017 From: aheinecke at gnupg.org (Andre Heinecke) Date: Wed, 8 Feb 2017 19:56:19 +0100 Subject: The GnuPG Verein is founded In-Reply-To: <87twaufex3.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> References: <87twaufex3.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> Message-ID: <201702081956.19479.aheinecke@gnupg.org> Hi, We've just finshed with a meeting and as part of this we finished the constitution and founded an association. Everyone on this list is invited to join all we require is a signed mail that states the intention to join the GnuPG Verein. The next step is now to get this association registered and to get it accepted as a non-profit organisation for the "common good" (for taxes). As I think Association is not a proper translation I am using "Verein" for this. On Saturday 26 November 2016 16:18:16 Werner Koch wrote: > At yesterday's meeting in Osnabr?ck we talked about a new organisation > structure for the project. I created the repo > > ssh://playfair.gnupg.org/git/gnupg-project.git You will now find in that repository under "legal/constitution.de.pdf" the offical constitution for the Verein that was signed by: Werner, Neal, Gniibe, Marcus, Kai, Justus and me (The seven people required by law) > To help our non-German speaking core hackers I would suggest to do most > of the required discussion in English. We need to write that document > in German and can then do an unofficial translation. Writing the > constitution in English would be possible in theory but will make things > _much_ harder. Thus we better do what the register court and the tax > office are used to. I've added a first english translation to the repo but I'm pretty sure it needs some more work because large parts of the constitution cover legal requirements and the meaning is hard to understand / translate. But it's version controlled so feel free to improve :-) We also held our first members assembly today, The offical decisions that were made were: - Election of the board: -- Werner is the President -- Marcus is the CFO (Kassierer / Money man) -- I'm the Vice President - Who will benifit if we agree to dissolve the Verein (?9): Free Software Friends e.V. (We mostly think this was not important as we don't see our Verein to be dissolved but it's a legal requirement) - If governmatal agencies require formal changes to the constution the board is allowed to make them withouth a new membership assembly. Until our next assembly we would like to keep membership limited to contributors / hackers but we might want to open it up a bit more in the future. We want to focus on gaining supporting members to have a membership base that helps with our funding. Regards, Andre -- Andre Heinecke | ++49-541-335083-262 | http://www.intevation.de/ Intevation GmbH, Neuer Graben 17, 49074 Osnabr?ck | AG Osnabr?ck, HR B 18998 Gesch?ftsf?hrer: Frank Koormann, Bernhard Reiter, Dr. Jan-Oliver Wagner From dkg at fifthhorseman.net Thu Feb 9 00:00:01 2017 From: dkg at fifthhorseman.net (Daniel Kahn Gillmor) Date: Wed, 08 Feb 2017 18:00:01 -0500 Subject: The GnuPG Verein is founded In-Reply-To: <201702081956.19479.aheinecke@gnupg.org> References: <87twaufex3.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> <201702081956.19479.aheinecke@gnupg.org> Message-ID: <87poiswaoe.fsf@alice.fifthhorseman.net> On Wed 2017-02-08 13:56:19 -0500, Andre Heinecke wrote: > We've just finshed with a meeting and as part of this we finished the > constitution and founded an association. congrats on getting the paperwork done! > Everyone on this list is invited to join all we require is a signed mail that > states the intention to join the GnuPG Verein. Is this a signed paper mail or a cryptographically-signed e-mail? What does it mean for a non-German person to join the Verein? my skim of constitution.en.tex looked plausible to me, but its outbound links to sections of German law are not anything that i am prepared to follow or understand deeply. The goals of the Verein as described in constitution are goals that i share and would be happy to support. --dkg -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 832 bytes Desc: not available URL: From wk at gnupg.org Thu Feb 9 10:15:31 2017 From: wk at gnupg.org (Werner Koch) Date: Thu, 09 Feb 2017 10:15:31 +0100 Subject: The GnuPG Verein is founded In-Reply-To: <201702081956.19479.aheinecke@gnupg.org> (Andre Heinecke's message of "Wed, 8 Feb 2017 19:56:19 +0100") References: <87twaufex3.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> <201702081956.19479.aheinecke@gnupg.org> Message-ID: <8737fng1xo.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> On Wed, 8 Feb 2017 19:56, aheinecke at gnupg.org said: > - Who will benifit if we agree to dissolve the Verein (?9): > Free Software Friends e.V. > (We mostly think this was not important as we don't see our Verein to be > dissolved but it's a legal requirement) Background: The Freie Software Freunde e.V. (we use the informal abbreviation FrSoFr and _not_ FSF) was founded by local activists from our region after we realized that the FSFE(urope) was not much interested in supporting our local political work in Northrhine-Westphalia (A German state with 18 million citizens). We could have just any other charitable association, but that was simply the easiest thing and we will share an office here in D?sseldorf (along with the C3S). Can be changed at any general assembly but as Andre mentioned, this is not more than a legal requirement. Shalom-Salam, Werner -- Die Gedanken sind frei. Ausnahmen regelt ein Bundesgesetz. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 227 bytes Desc: not available URL: From marcus.brinkmann at ruhr-uni-bochum.de Thu Feb 9 12:43:02 2017 From: marcus.brinkmann at ruhr-uni-bochum.de (Marcus Brinkmann) Date: Thu, 9 Feb 2017 12:43:02 +0100 Subject: The GnuPG Verein is founded In-Reply-To: <201702081956.19479.aheinecke@gnupg.org> References: <87twaufex3.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> <201702081956.19479.aheinecke@gnupg.org> Message-ID: <212ec562-45da-0992-c6ad-bd9fca4702a3@ruhr-uni-bochum.de> Hi Andre, I just announced it on twitter, see below. The git repository is not visible on the public git server, can we get a web page with the "articles of the association" (seems to be a better translation than constitution) set up quickly? https://twitter.com/gnupg/status/829654739369467905 On 02/08/2017 07:56 PM, Andre Heinecke wrote: > Hi, > > We've just finshed with a meeting and as part of this we finished the > constitution and founded an association. > > Everyone on this list is invited to join all we require is a signed mail that > states the intention to join the GnuPG Verein. > > The next step is now to get this association registered and to get it accepted > as a non-profit organisation for the "common good" (for taxes). As I think > Association is not a proper translation I am using "Verein" for this. > > On Saturday 26 November 2016 16:18:16 Werner Koch wrote: >> At yesterday's meeting in Osnabr?ck we talked about a new organisation >> structure for the project. I created the repo >> >> ssh://playfair.gnupg.org/git/gnupg-project.git > > You will now find in that repository under "legal/constitution.de.pdf" the > offical constitution for the Verein that was signed by: > Werner, Neal, Gniibe, Marcus, Kai, Justus and me (The seven people required by > law) > >> To help our non-German speaking core hackers I would suggest to do most >> of the required discussion in English. We need to write that document >> in German and can then do an unofficial translation. Writing the >> constitution in English would be possible in theory but will make things >> _much_ harder. Thus we better do what the register court and the tax >> office are used to. > > I've added a first english translation to the repo but I'm pretty sure it > needs some more work because large parts of the constitution cover legal > requirements and the meaning is hard to understand / translate. > > But it's version controlled so feel free to improve :-) > > We also held our first members assembly today, The offical decisions that were > made were: > > - Election of the board: > -- Werner is the President > -- Marcus is the CFO (Kassierer / Money man) > -- I'm the Vice President > > - Who will benifit if we agree to dissolve the Verein (?9): > Free Software Friends e.V. > (We mostly think this was not important as we don't see our Verein to be > dissolved but it's a legal requirement) > > - If governmatal agencies require formal changes to the constution the board > is allowed to make them withouth a new membership assembly. > > > Until our next assembly we would like to keep membership limited to > contributors / hackers but we might want to open it up a bit more in the > future. We want to focus on gaining supporting members to have a membership > base that helps with our funding. > > > Regards, > Andre > From wk at gnupg.org Thu Feb 9 18:43:17 2017 From: wk at gnupg.org (Werner Koch) Date: Thu, 09 Feb 2017 18:43:17 +0100 Subject: The GnuPG Verein is founded In-Reply-To: <87poiswaoe.fsf@alice.fifthhorseman.net> (Daniel Kahn Gillmor's message of "Wed, 08 Feb 2017 18:00:01 -0500") References: <87twaufex3.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> <201702081956.19479.aheinecke@gnupg.org> <87poiswaoe.fsf@alice.fifthhorseman.net> Message-ID: <87zihvclai.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> On Thu, 9 Feb 2017 00:00, dkg at fifthhorseman.net said: > congrats on getting the paperwork done! Not fully done. The boring office work needs to be done. However, getting 7 people together to start the process was a big achievement. > Is this a signed paper mail or a cryptographically-signed e-mail? The constitution says that a mail with an "Advanced Signature" (a legal term in Germany) is equivalent to a signed sheet of paper. OpenPGP is clearly an "Advanced Signature". So this should indeed be easy. > What does it mean for a non-German person to join the Verein? my skim of > constitution.en.tex looked plausible to me, but its outbound links to > sections of German law are not anything that i am prepared to follow or > understand deeply. You basically have no real responsibility. When a member decides not to join the general assembly, this is totally fine and actually pretty common for large "Vereine". Members of the board have some legal responsibility but that is in practice limited to gross negligence. The constitution says that bylaws for membership fees may be published. I would actually be in favor of this and require annual fees of, say, 12 Euros. The reason is that such fees are very common in German and not having membership fees can raise questions from the register court. I know that non-German people tend to complain about such requirements and thus we can also say, that membership fees are replaced by some kind of work done for the Verein (this is how the FSFE does it). > The goals of the Verein as described in constitution are goals that i > share and would be happy to support. That is be much appreciated. Shalom-Salam, Werner -- Die Gedanken sind frei. Ausnahmen regelt ein Bundesgesetz. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 227 bytes Desc: not available URL: From wk at gnupg.org Thu Feb 9 18:27:34 2017 From: wk at gnupg.org (Werner Koch) Date: Thu, 09 Feb 2017 18:27:34 +0100 Subject: The GnuPG Verein is founded In-Reply-To: <212ec562-45da-0992-c6ad-bd9fca4702a3@ruhr-uni-bochum.de> (Marcus Brinkmann's message of "Thu, 9 Feb 2017 12:43:02 +0100") References: <87twaufex3.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> <201702081956.19479.aheinecke@gnupg.org> <212ec562-45da-0992-c6ad-bd9fca4702a3@ruhr-uni-bochum.de> Message-ID: <874m03e0l5.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> On Thu, 9 Feb 2017 12:43, marcus.brinkmann at ruhr-uni-bochum.de said: > I just announced it on twitter, see below. The git repository is not Thanks. > visible on the public git server, can we get a web page with the > "articles of the association" (seems to be a better translation than > constitution) set up quickly? [Shouldn't we wait for a public page until we have been registered? ] I would suggsted to have a gnupg.org/verein arc. For now we can put the pages into the gnupg-doc repo. However that is only required for org-mode pages. Uploading a PDF would even be simpler (maybe into the ftp space - it is https: accessible)? Regatding the translation of "Verein": Verein \Ver*ein"\, n. [G.] A union, association, or society; -- used in names of German organizations. [Webster 1913 Suppl.] Okay, we are not a "union". "Association" seems to be okay. Can any native speaker explain "society" (e.g. there is the IEEE Computer Society). Salam-Shalom, Werner -- Die Gedanken sind frei. Ausnahmen regelt ein Bundesgesetz. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 227 bytes Desc: not available URL: From aheinecke at gnupg.org Fri Feb 10 11:05:07 2017 From: aheinecke at gnupg.org (Andre Heinecke) Date: Fri, 10 Feb 2017 11:05:07 +0100 Subject: The GnuPG Verein is founded In-Reply-To: <874m03e0l5.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> References: <87twaufex3.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> <212ec562-45da-0992-c6ad-bd9fca4702a3@ruhr-uni-bochum.de> <874m03e0l5.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> Message-ID: <4276016.J82iMD2gmC@esus> Hi, On Thursday 09 February 2017 18:27:34 Werner Koch wrote: > On Thu, 9 Feb 2017 12:43, marcus.brinkmann at ruhr-uni-bochum.de said: > > I just announced it on twitter, see below. The git repository is not > > visible on the public git server, can we get a web page with the > > "articles of the association" (seems to be a better translation than > > constitution) set up quickly? The FSFE uses the word constitution. [1] But I think "articles of association" could also be a correct translation especially if we decide to call ourself the GnuPG Association in English. > [Shouldn't we wait for a public page until we have been registered? ] I don't think so, afaik we are currently a "Nicht rechtsf?higer Verein" but already a Verein and we are waiting for the paperwork to become an "Eingetragener Verein" after which we will gain the suffix e.V. as outlined in our articles of the association. So we can already accept members etc. > I would suggsted to have a gnupg.org/verein arc. For now we can put the > pages into the gnupg-doc repo. However that is only required for > org-mode pages. Uploading a PDF would even be simpler (maybe into the > ftp space - it is https: accessible)? > > Regatding the translation of "Verein": > > Verein \Ver*ein"\, n. [G.] > A union, association, or society; -- used in names of German > organizations. > [Webster 1913 Suppl.] > > Okay, we are not a "union". "Association" seems to be okay. Can any > native speaker explain "society" (e.g. there is the IEEE Computer > Society). According to Wikipedia [2] it's translatable to "Registered association" which is also what the FSFE uses (Verein -> Association and Registered Assocication -> Eingetragener Verein) So I think "GnuPG Association" might actually be the most appropiate translation. But I kind of prefer "GnuPG e.V." as the name once we are registered because it's more catchy then "GnuPG Registered Association". I kind of like the German connotation of the name "GnuPG Verein", who does not like Germans nowadays...? [3] ;-) Regards, Andre 1: https://fsfe.org/about/legal/legal.en.html 2: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eingetragener_Verein 3: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HMQkV5cTuoY -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 659 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part. URL: From aheinecke at gnupg.org Fri Feb 10 11:21:00 2017 From: aheinecke at gnupg.org (Andre Heinecke) Date: Fri, 10 Feb 2017 11:21 +0100 Subject: The GnuPG Verein is founded In-Reply-To: <4ac07a10-2663-0b24-f340-497aa4387d47@sumptuouscapital.com> References: <87twaufex3.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> <201702081956.19479.aheinecke@gnupg.org> <4ac07a10-2663-0b24-f340-497aa4387d47@sumptuouscapital.com> Message-ID: <1876274.zdWakH52Hk@esus> Hi, On Wednesday 08 February 2017 21:27:45 Kristian Fiskerstrand wrote: > I'm in Great. I think I can tell you that your membership application has been accepted as we already agreed on this. Btw. subscription to the verein mailing list is open: https://lists.gnupg.org/mailman/listinfo/verein > > The next step is now to get this association registered and to get it > > accepted as a non-profit organisation for the "common good" (for taxes). > > As I think Association is not a proper translation I am using "Verein" > > for this. > Foundation? Afaik Foundation has a different meaning as it is translated to the german "Stiftung" which is a different kind of entity. > Is this also available in a repository that doesn't require ssh > credentials? Afaik not yet. Regards, Andre -- Andre Heinecke | ++49-541-335083-262 | http://www.intevation.de/ Intevation GmbH, Neuer Graben 17, 49074 Osnabr?ck | AG Osnabr?ck, HR B 18998 Gesch?ftsf?hrer: Frank Koormann, Bernhard Reiter, Dr. Jan-Oliver Wagner -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 659 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part. URL: From wk at gnupg.org Fri Feb 10 11:32:37 2017 From: wk at gnupg.org (Werner Koch) Date: Fri, 10 Feb 2017 11:32:37 +0100 Subject: The GnuPG Verein is founded In-Reply-To: <1876274.zdWakH52Hk@esus> (Andre Heinecke's message of "Fri, 10 Feb 2017 11:21 +0100") References: <87twaufex3.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> <201702081956.19479.aheinecke@gnupg.org> <4ac07a10-2663-0b24-f340-497aa4387d47@sumptuouscapital.com> <1876274.zdWakH52Hk@esus> Message-ID: <87efz6cp4q.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> On Fri, 10 Feb 2017 11:21, aheinecke at gnupg.org said: >> Is this also available in a repository that doesn't require ssh >> credentials? > > Afaik not yet. Now it is available: git://git.gnupg.org/gnupg-project.git Welcome Kristian, Shalom-Salam, Werner -- Die Gedanken sind frei. Ausnahmen regelt ein Bundesgesetz. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 227 bytes Desc: not available URL: From wk at gnupg.org Fri Feb 10 11:42:13 2017 From: wk at gnupg.org (Werner Koch) Date: Fri, 10 Feb 2017 11:42:13 +0100 Subject: The GnuPG Verein is founded In-Reply-To: <212ec562-45da-0992-c6ad-bd9fca4702a3@ruhr-uni-bochum.de> (Marcus Brinkmann's message of "Thu, 9 Feb 2017 12:43:02 +0100") References: <87twaufex3.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> <201702081956.19479.aheinecke@gnupg.org> <212ec562-45da-0992-c6ad-bd9fca4702a3@ruhr-uni-bochum.de> Message-ID: <8760kicooq.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> On Thu, 9 Feb 2017 12:43, marcus.brinkmann at ruhr-uni-bochum.de said: > I just announced it on twitter, see below. The git repository is not > visible on the public git server, can we get a web page with the I just fixed that. See git.gnupg.org under "others" The mailing list archive is member-only - can we make it open? I think it is better to do that sooner than later so that we do not need to ask all posters whether they agree to have their old posts published. Right now post are from: - Andre - dkg - Marcus - Werner - okay to publish. Salam-Shalom, Werner -- Die Gedanken sind frei. Ausnahmen regelt ein Bundesgesetz. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 227 bytes Desc: not available URL: From aheinecke at gnupg.org Fri Feb 10 11:50:01 2017 From: aheinecke at gnupg.org (Andre Heinecke) Date: Fri, 10 Feb 2017 11:50:01 +0100 Subject: The GnuPG Verein is founded In-Reply-To: <8760kicooq.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> References: <87twaufex3.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> <212ec562-45da-0992-c6ad-bd9fca4702a3@ruhr-uni-bochum.de> <8760kicooq.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> Message-ID: <8217772.oI6Tq2yB8v@esus> On Friday 10 February 2017 11:42:13 Werner Koch wrote: > - Andre > - dkg > - Marcus > - Werner - okay to publish. Okay to publish from me. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 659 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part. URL: From marcus.brinkmann at ruhr-uni-bochum.de Fri Feb 10 11:56:34 2017 From: marcus.brinkmann at ruhr-uni-bochum.de (Marcus Brinkmann) Date: Fri, 10 Feb 2017 11:56:34 +0100 Subject: The GnuPG Verein is founded In-Reply-To: <8217772.oI6Tq2yB8v@esus> References: <87twaufex3.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> <212ec562-45da-0992-c6ad-bd9fca4702a3@ruhr-uni-bochum.de> <8760kicooq.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> <8217772.oI6Tq2yB8v@esus> Message-ID: <5ae127c0-0a3c-9543-c949-8c6ae7dd9b6a@ruhr-uni-bochum.de> On 02/10/2017 11:50 AM, Andre Heinecke wrote: > On Friday 10 February 2017 11:42:13 Werner Koch wrote: >> - Andre >> - dkg >> - Marcus >> - Werner - okay to publish. > > Okay to publish from me. Okay from me, too. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 819 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature URL: From wk at gnupg.org Fri Feb 10 12:19:11 2017 From: wk at gnupg.org (Werner Koch) Date: Fri, 10 Feb 2017 12:19:11 +0100 Subject: mail addresses Message-ID: <87mvdu9tu8.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> Hi! Given that we use verein at gnupg for this mailing list, we need another address to write to the verein privately. And we should also provide a key for that address. ev - is too short and might ve a personal address. vorstand - is an expected addresses, board - ditto. office - ditto info - I guess there is aloready one but we can use that one. BTW, shall we have the web pages under - gnupg.org/verein - gnupg.org/ev - verein.gnupg.org - ev.gnupg.org ? Shalom-Salam, Werner -- Die Gedanken sind frei. Ausnahmen regelt ein Bundesgesetz. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 227 bytes Desc: not available URL: From aheinecke at gnupg.org Fri Feb 10 12:53:15 2017 From: aheinecke at gnupg.org (Andre Heinecke) Date: Fri, 10 Feb 2017 12:53:15 +0100 Subject: mail addresses In-Reply-To: <87mvdu9tu8.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> References: <87mvdu9tu8.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> Message-ID: <3147016.0Qa2XxY4Ts@esus> Hi, On Friday 10 February 2017 12:19:11 Werner Koch wrote: > Given that we use verein at gnupg for this mailing list, we need another > address to write to the verein privately. And we should also provide a > key for that address. > > ev - is too short and might ve a personal address. > vorstand - is an expected addresses, > board - ditto. > office - ditto > info - I guess there is aloready one but we can use that one. My preference is board. Because I think english should be our primary language and it will reflect who is reached by this addres (If you plan to restrict this address to the board) Under office I would expect some office worker. Under Info I would expect some marketing. > BTW, shall we have the web pages under > > - gnupg.org/verein > - gnupg.org/ev > - verein.gnupg.org > - ev.gnupg.org I dislike "ev" because its meaning is too abigous. If we stick with "Verein" instead of Association or something else my preference would be for: verein.gnupg.org gnupg.org/verein would also work but I think it's slightly easier to seperate verein.gnupg.org from gnupg.org. Regards, Andre -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 659 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part. URL: From aheinecke at gnupg.org Fri Feb 10 13:25:28 2017 From: aheinecke at gnupg.org (Andre Heinecke) Date: Fri, 10 Feb 2017 13:25:28 +0100 Subject: The GnuPG Verein is founded In-Reply-To: <874m03e0l5.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> References: <87twaufex3.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> <212ec562-45da-0992-c6ad-bd9fca4702a3@ruhr-uni-bochum.de> <874m03e0l5.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> Message-ID: <4481929.VREFrHTx0x@esus> Hi, On Thursday 09 February 2017 18:27:34 Werner Koch wrote: > Regatding the translation of "Verein": > > Verein \Ver*ein"\, n. [G.] > A union, association, or society; -- used in names of German > organizations. > [Webster 1913 Suppl.] > > Okay, we are not a "union". "Association" seems to be okay. Can any > native speaker explain "society" (e.g. there is the IEEE Computer > Society). As Werner is setting up more infrastructure under the name "Verein" and as our constitution says that our name will eventually (if we are properly registered) have the name "GnuPG e.V." (thus containing the abbrevation for Verein in the name) I have now added a subsection to the Pr?ambel of the constitution: \subsection{Disclaimer on translated versions} This version of the constitution was translated from the German version of the constitution. This translation is unofficial and not legally binding.\\ The word ?Verein? is left untranslated as it is part of the name. The meaning of ?Verein? is roughly equivalent to ?Association? or ?Society?. Does anyone object to continue the usage of the word "Verein" ? Regards, Andre -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 659 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part. URL: From wk at gnupg.org Fri Feb 10 16:14:44 2017 From: wk at gnupg.org (Werner Koch) Date: Fri, 10 Feb 2017 16:14:44 +0100 Subject: Constitution 1.0.1 Message-ID: <87y3xe6psr.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> Hi! I checked the communication we had last year with the registration court when setting up Freie Software Freunde e.V. There were two issues which our chair was able to fix w/o a new assembly. The changes required by the court are: - We have to state that there will be a membership fee (but not how much, or any other details). - We need to specify who signs the minutes of an assembly. I will discuss this with our lawyer. Here is a diff.: --8<---------------cut here---------------start------------->8--- diff --git a/legal/constitution.de.tex b/legal/constitution.de.tex index 50fefde..308ccc3 100644 --- a/legal/constitution.de.tex +++ b/legal/constitution.de.tex @@ -127,9 +127,13 @@ Personen werden. \A F?rdermitglieder haben keine satzungsgem??en Rechte. \section{Mitgliedsbeitr?ge} -Der Vorstand kann eine Beitragsordnung erlassen. Sie bedarf der + +\A Es wird von den Mitgliedern auch ein finanzieller Beitrag erhoben. + +\A Der Vorstand kann eine Beitragsordnung erlassen. Sie bedarf der Zustimmung der Mitgliederversammlung. + \section{Organe} Die Organe des Vereins sind: \begin{enumerate} @@ -176,8 +180,9 @@ Mehrheit der abgegebenen Stimmen auf sich vereinigt. \A Zur ?nderung der Satzung und zur Aufl?sung des Vereins ist die Mehrheit von drei Viertel der abgegebenen Stimmen erforderlich. -\A ?ber die Mitgliederversammlung ist ein Protokoll anzufertigen. - +\A ?ber die Mitgliederversammlung ist ein Protokoll anzufertigen. Das +Protokoll ist vom eingangs der Versammlung gew?hlten Protokollf?hrer, +hilfsweise vom Vorsitzenden zu unterschreiben. \section{Vorstand} Der Vorstand besteht aus drei Mitgliedern: --8<---------------cut here---------------end--------------->8--- Salam-Shalom, Werner -- Die Gedanken sind frei. Ausnahmen regelt ein Bundesgesetz. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 227 bytes Desc: not available URL: From dkg at fifthhorseman.net Fri Feb 10 17:31:54 2017 From: dkg at fifthhorseman.net (Daniel Kahn Gillmor) Date: Fri, 10 Feb 2017 11:31:54 -0500 Subject: The GnuPG Verein is founded In-Reply-To: <8760kicooq.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> References: <87twaufex3.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> <201702081956.19479.aheinecke@gnupg.org> <212ec562-45da-0992-c6ad-bd9fca4702a3@ruhr-uni-bochum.de> <8760kicooq.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> Message-ID: <8760kit3b9.fsf@alice.fifthhorseman.net> On Fri 2017-02-10 05:42:13 -0500, Werner Koch wrote: > The mailing list archive is member-only - can we make it open? I think > it is better to do that sooner than later so that we do not need to ask > all posters whether they agree to have their old posts published. > > Right now post are from: > > - Andre > - dkg > - Marcus > - Werner - okay to publish. ok from me as well. --dkg From dkg at fifthhorseman.net Fri Feb 10 17:35:58 2017 From: dkg at fifthhorseman.net (Daniel Kahn Gillmor) Date: Fri, 10 Feb 2017 11:35:58 -0500 Subject: mail addresses In-Reply-To: <87mvdu9tu8.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> References: <87mvdu9tu8.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> Message-ID: <8737fmt34h.fsf@alice.fifthhorseman.net> On Fri 2017-02-10 06:19:11 -0500, Werner Koch wrote: > Given that we use verein at gnupg for this mailing list, we need another > address to write to the verein privately. And we should also provide a > key for that address. > > ev - is too short and might ve a personal address. > vorstand - is an expected addresses, > board - ditto. > office - ditto > info - I guess there is aloready one but we can use that one. I don't care which address is used, but if the incoming messages are expected to be distributed to multiple people (and if those people use the address to communicate privately to one another as well), i recommend the use of schleuder version 3 or later for the re-mailing capabilities: https://0xacab.org/schleuder/schleuder The project is very helpful and responsive upstream, the package will be supported in debian stretch, and it uses GnuPG as a backend. I can help get it set up if that would be useful. --dkg -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 832 bytes Desc: not available URL: From dkg at fifthhorseman.net Fri Feb 10 17:37:37 2017 From: dkg at fifthhorseman.net (Daniel Kahn Gillmor) Date: Fri, 10 Feb 2017 11:37:37 -0500 Subject: The GnuPG Verein is founded In-Reply-To: <87zihvclai.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> References: <87twaufex3.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> <201702081956.19479.aheinecke@gnupg.org> <87poiswaoe.fsf@alice.fifthhorseman.net> <87zihvclai.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> Message-ID: <87zihuroha.fsf@alice.fifthhorseman.net> On Thu 2017-02-09 12:43:17 -0500, Werner Koch wrote: > On Thu, 9 Feb 2017 00:00, dkg at fifthhorseman.net said: >> What does it mean for a non-German person to join the Verein? my skim of >> constitution.en.tex looked plausible to me, but its outbound links to >> sections of German law are not anything that i am prepared to follow or >> understand deeply. > > You basically have no real responsibility. When a member decides not to > join the general assembly, this is totally fine and actually pretty > common for large "Vereine". Members of the board have some legal > responsibility but that is in practice limited to gross negligence. > > The constitution says that bylaws for membership fees may be published. > I would actually be in favor of this and require annual fees of, say, 12 > Euros. The reason is that such fees are very common in German and not > having membership fees can raise questions from the register court. I > know that non-German people tend to complain about such requirements and > thus we can also say, that membership fees are replaced by some kind of > work done for the Verein (this is how the FSFE does it). > >> The goals of the Verein as described in constitution are goals that i >> share and would be happy to support. > > That is be much appreciated. Sounds good to me. I'm in. Regards, --dkg -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 832 bytes Desc: not available URL: From wk at gnupg.org Fri Feb 10 18:10:31 2017 From: wk at gnupg.org (Werner Koch) Date: Fri, 10 Feb 2017 18:10:31 +0100 Subject: mail addresses In-Reply-To: <8737fmt34h.fsf@alice.fifthhorseman.net> (Daniel Kahn Gillmor's message of "Fri, 10 Feb 2017 11:35:58 -0500") References: <87mvdu9tu8.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> <8737fmt34h.fsf@alice.fifthhorseman.net> Message-ID: <8737fm6kfs.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> On Fri, 10 Feb 2017 17:35, dkg at fifthhorseman.net said: > I don't care which address is used, but if the incoming messages are We are using board at . > recommend the use of schleuder version 3 or later for the re-mailing > capabilities: I know about it but thanks for the reminder. For the 3 addresses I don't think this is required. Instead we will use a shared key. Yes, we should set the OpenPGP key flag 0x80 to set declare that the key is shared bey several people. However, GnuPG has no support for this. Salam-Shalom, Werner -- Die Gedanken sind frei. Ausnahmen regelt ein Bundesgesetz. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 227 bytes Desc: not available URL: From wk at gnupg.org Fri Feb 10 18:24:21 2017 From: wk at gnupg.org (Werner Koch) Date: Fri, 10 Feb 2017 18:24:21 +0100 Subject: The GnuPG Verein is founded In-Reply-To: <8760kit3b9.fsf@alice.fifthhorseman.net> (Daniel Kahn Gillmor's message of "Fri, 10 Feb 2017 11:31:54 -0500") References: <87twaufex3.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> <201702081956.19479.aheinecke@gnupg.org> <212ec562-45da-0992-c6ad-bd9fca4702a3@ruhr-uni-bochum.de> <8760kicooq.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> <8760kit3b9.fsf@alice.fifthhorseman.net> Message-ID: <87wpcy558a.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> On Fri, 10 Feb 2017 17:31, dkg at fifthhorseman.net said: > ok from me as well. Thanks. Mail archive is now public at the expected URL. Shalom-Salam, Werner -- Die Gedanken sind frei. Ausnahmen regelt ein Bundesgesetz. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 227 bytes Desc: not available URL: From wk at gnupg.org Mon Feb 13 08:55:51 2017 From: wk at gnupg.org (Werner Koch) Date: Mon, 13 Feb 2017 08:55:51 +0100 Subject: membership of dkg (was: The GnuPG Verein is founded) In-Reply-To: <87zihuroha.fsf@alice.fifthhorseman.net> (Daniel Kahn Gillmor's message of "Fri, 10 Feb 2017 11:37:37 -0500") References: <87twaufex3.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> <201702081956.19479.aheinecke@gnupg.org> <87poiswaoe.fsf@alice.fifthhorseman.net> <87zihvclai.fsf@wheatstone.g10code.de> <87zihuroha.fsf@alice.fifthhorseman.net> Message-ID: <87h93y34oo.fsf_-_@wheatstone.g10code.de> On Fri, 10 Feb 2017 17:37, dkg at fifthhorseman.net said: >>> The goals of the Verein as described in constitution are goals that i >>> share and would be happy to support. >> >> That is be much appreciated. > > Sounds good to me. I'm in. Welcome as member number 9. Shalom-Salam, Werner -- Die Gedanken sind frei. 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