GnuPG 1.0.4-1 + IDEA for Windows

[Michael H. Warfield]

On Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 11:06:39AM -0800, ESP wrote:

> Yeah, except it's patented, and you're therefore breaking the GPL.

	Yes, and you are still ignoring the issue of "what jurisdiction?"
This is perfectly and completely legal in the EC.  So he can get it hosted
in the EC and not violate the GPL?  If that is violating the GPL, what's
stopping some banana republic from claiming XOR is patented (it was, by
Xerox)?

>     KR> The no patents clause of the GPL is stupid! 

> Whatever! Don't use the software if you don't agree to the
> license. And especially don't redistribute it!

	The patents clause of the GPL is invalid simply because it doesn't
address the issue of jurisdiction.  With that clause in place, we either
have software which is GPL in some countries and not in either, or we
say that any patent anywhere applies which places the GPL hostage to
any past, present or future patent scheme in any country in the world,
or we say that one countrie's jurisdiction applies to the entire world.
(The US applying to EC, yeah right...  They'll be singing Jingle Bells
in hades.)

	I agree with other posters.  This is NOT an issue for this list.
This is an issue for Ascom and FSF (and far FAR more for Ascom than FSF).
If they do not wish to take action, we have no place in bitching.  If they
wish to permit it for those people who take them up on their offer of
noncommercial licenses, that's fine too.  Not for us to say.

> If you really strongly disagree with the GPL on this matter, why don't
> you build your own damn encryption system, put whatever patented crap
> you want in it, and distribute it?

	He has meet the letter of the GPL as applied in the EC.  If it
doesn't apply in the US, fine.  Distribute it from one of the .nl crypto
sites.  Replay changed names and is now what, zedz.net?  Upload it to
zedz.net and be done with it!  What are you going to do then?  It meets
the full letter of the GPL.  Idea is NOT patented in that jurisdiction.

>     KR> Why can't we provide TWO versions and let the users decide
>     KR> which best meets there needs?

> Well, at the very least, you're requiring some expensive lawyer time
> to get you to do something that you know you're going to have to do
> eventually. What good does that do?

>     KR> The unix users have had this choice for some time, why are the
>     KR> Window's users less deserving?  I am not taking anything away
>     KR> from Werner or anyone else.

> You know, that's not for us to decide. It's the patent holder that's
> decided it, and there is a work-around already.

>         http://www.gnupg.org/gph/en/pgp2x.html

	You're right!  It is up to the patent holder, which does not exist
in Europe, since the patent doesn't exist in Europe.

> The workaround is there because of the patents.

>     KR> So it's real simple.  Either leave me alone and let the users
>     KR> decide which version they want, or force me to stop.  I am not
>     KR> trying to steal anyone's work or make money off it. 

> No, you're just being confrontational and obnoxious with someone who's
> given you a gift. That's got to be the most dickheaded thing in the
> world.

	You are both being obnoxious.  Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't
you call him a dick head?  And your are calling HIM obnoxious?  Sounds
like you both need some growing up to do.

> Werner and tons of other people worked REAL HARD to make GnuPG for
> you. They've done a lot to give you absolutely free encryption. And
> they even did everything they could within the bounds of the law to
> make it work with PGP. They've thought it through more than you.

> They gave you the software for FREE, under some very easy terms (the
> GPL). You are breaking those terms and acting like you're being put
> upon. Creep.

	DISTRIBUTE THE DAMN THING FROM EUROPE!

	There is no patent on Idea in Europe.  There are plenty of sites
in Europe from which to distribute it.  It is perfectly legal and, until
the GPL codifies US patent law in all things GPL, conforms to the GPL
in that jurisdiction.  What the rest of us do with it is up to us.

>     KR> I am merely adding some much requested functionality.

> ...which is not in there for a very good reason. God, you're an ass.

	YOU BOTH ARE!  You just got done telling him that he's offensive.
Why don't you read your own postings as if you were the other person.
Right now, I'm not sure which of the two of you is more offensive!!!!

> ~ESP

	My 0.02 euro.

> -- 
>  ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>            ESP <evangelo@pigdog.org> | http://pigdog.org/
>        "Fan belts break at 3AM. I get mad, drinks get spilled."
>  ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

	Mike
-- 
 Michael H. Warfield    |  (770) 985-6132   |  mhw@WittsEnd.com
  (The Mad Wizard)      |  (678) 463-0932   |  http://www.wittsend.com/mhw/
  NIC whois:  MHW9      |  An optimist believes we live in the best of all
 PGP Key: 0xDF1DD471    |  possible worlds.  A pessimist is sure of it!

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